Rick Joyner on Wheat and Tares
Morning Star's Rick Joyner has written an article on Discerning the Wheat From the Tares
. He writes about mature and immature prophets. In this context he says, in part:
Young, immature prophetic people will often behave unskilled, and we will be tempted to think that they are really "tares" instead of "wheat." Those who do not listen to the wisdom of the Lord, and try to weed out the tares prematurely, often throw out the "wheat" and keep the "tares."
Many churches and church leaders want the prophetic, but only after it has become mature. Of course, this would be easier in the short-term, but would actually be very costly in the end. It is by going through the "maturity process," and learning the nature of each from the maturing of both the wheat and tares, that a church and its leadership are prepared to handle the responsibility of a mature prophetic ministry. It is also the way we will be able to discern the false.
I have watched a number of times as churches and ministries rejected immature prophetic people because they still had problems. These same churches and ministries are usually then deceived by a false prophet that inevitably causes much harm. They then blame their problems on "the prophetic."
I'm still looking for a scriptural reference to training schools for the biblical prophets. Joyner then sites the Apostle Paul as a maturing apostle, using him as an example of how an apostle can mature, and in the same way, a prophet can mature. He writes:
We should also begin to recognize the tares that are among the wheat in any movement as they mature. One of the great examples of how the wheat matures is the Apostle Paul. In one of his early letters, he stated that he was not inferior to even the most eminent apostles (see II Corinthians 11:5). He wrote about five years later that he was the "least of the apostles" (see I Corinthians 15:9). In a letter he wrote about five years after this, he stated that he was "the least of the saints"(see Ephesians 3:8. In one of his last letters, he declared himself to be "the greatest of sinners" (see I Timothy 1:15. He kept seeing himself as less important, though he was obviously growing in spiritual stature, and actually was one of the most important first century apostles.
I don't believe Paul was really bragging in 2 Cor. 11:5. According to most commentaries, in context, it would appear that Paul was referring to the term the false teachers used for the real apostles, where the false teachers mockingly referred to super apostles. He wasn't puffed up with pride, as Joyner would suggest.
Secondly, Joyner appeals to 1 Corinthians 15:9 to show that Paul was a little more humble than he was five years previously. Besides the fact that most people place the two letters not more than a year apart, Joyner has 1
Corinthians written five years AFTER 2
Corinthians! Correcting Joyner's error, and using Joyner's logic, that would mean Paul was backsliding, not maturing! So much for that theory!
Finally, it is faulty reasoning to think that, because an apostle can mature, a prophet can as well. Prophets were called on to be 100% correct 100% of the time.
Labels: Rick Joyner
Epic Church Makes the News
The blogs "One Apostolic and Catholic Church" and "North Woods Seelsorger" have been talking about an LCMS church that has, to put it politely, gone off the deep end. Now Epic Church, as it is known, has made Fox News
for its outrageous style:
A Lutheran pastor in suburban Detroit looking for creative ways to discuss sex with his congregants has some people hot and bothered with his most recent tactic.
Epic Church Pastor Tim Kade, 40, kicked off the first Sunday in Lent with a sermon entitled, “The Greatest Sex You’ll Ever Have.”
He plans to focus on sex — topics such as frustrations couples face in their relationships and how to talk to kids about sex — every Sunday through April 1 at his Hills, Mich., church. Some sermon titles include: "The Bedroom: Battleground or Playground” and “Porn: What's the Big Deal?”
You can read the rest of the story at the Fox link above. Time for a little church discipline!
Meet Muslim Michael
Jackson Confirms Conversion to Islam
Pop superstar Michael Jackson has confirmed his conversion to Islam, according to reports in the Middle East.
The Arab-Israeli newspaper Panorama claims Jackson has announced the move and revealed plans to move to Bahrain, where he has purchased property.
The singer's Muslim brother Jermaine Friday claimed the "Thriller" hitmaker had taken interest in the religion since Jermaine converted in 1989, and had been considering converting following his acquittal on child abuse charges in 2005.
Jermaine said, "When I came back from Mecca I got him a lot of books and he asked me lots of things about my religion and I told him that it's peaceful and beautiful.
Labels: Michael Jackson
Such Language From God!!!!!
From, of course, the overactive imagination of Kim Clement, Phoenix, AZ, Feb. 10th, 2007:
God said, "Watch out--an acceleration has begun, and you will run faster than the chariots of Ahab," says the Lord.
God says, "You will run faster than the chariots of Ahab. You will run faster than the chariots of Ahab." Ahab represents puppeteers that have no backbone and stand for nothing but judgment.
God said, "Phooey! I am the one who decides on judgment," and God said, "judgment will not come to this land this year. Yes, there may be war; yes, there may be attacks, but it is not My judgment," says the Lord.
The last time I heard the word "phooey" was when I was a child. Now, I know Jesus said that unless we become like little children, we won't enter the kingdom of Heaven, but is this what He meant??? Does anyone have the Hebrew equivalent for "phooey"? I want to look it up in Strongs Concordance?
Labels: Kim Clement
Did I Miss Something???
Kim Clement has a prophecy dated February 9th which reads, in part (Click Here
During the summer and at the Mardi Gras, says the Lord, at New Orleans, watch what I do. There is going to be an interference in the Mardi Gras, says the Lord. God said, listen you hear that? That sound of joy, the music of the one that sits and plays. And God said, you watch what I do in the Mardi Gras, watch what I do in a place of great perversion. Watch what I do. I am focusing this year on your children and this is the year of acceleration, this is the year of multiplication. Your children shall begin and it shall not, says the Lord. It will not stop because I long for the sound of child-like faith. I long for the sound of a little child to come to me.
Am I missing something here? Wasn't the Mardi Gras on February 20th? I don't remember hearing about anything unusual on CNN, Fox, or MSNBC.
Labels: Kim Clement
Modern Depictions of God
Excellent article on FoxNews.com on modern depictions of God today. Click headline for the story.
Signs and Wonders - Benny-Style
Benny Hinn now runs an on-line course called "Signs and Wonders School of Ministry."
By taking this wonderful course, you too will be able to perform signs and wonders to accompany your profession of faith in Jesus Christ.
Now, I know you never read about the school that Jeremiah, Elijah, Ezekiel, and the Apostles Paul, Peter, Matthew, John attended to obtain their power and perform their miracles, but it's obvious they must have done so. I mean, God couldn't have just given them these powers - it requires a school to learn them, right? It's a shame God waited 2,000 years to restore this school, but that's life! So be sure to sign up - only $75 for the 13 week course!
In the meantime, Benny can be seen going from hospital to hospital healing the sick and emptying out the emergency wards.
Labels: Benny Hinn
I Am Jesus, I Am Antichrist - I am the Walrus???
From WFOR-TV in Doral, FL:
If you thought it was shocking when we first introduced you to a local preacher who claims to be Jesus Christ, you’ll want to sit down for this.
More than 12 members of a Doral based church showed up at a South Beach tattoo parlor to get the numbers 666 tattooed on themselves, all as a show of faith to preacher Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda, who is now sporting a 666 tattoo of his own.
"I am Jesus Christ man," he said in front of our cameras. “The second coming of Christ."
In September 2006, which was less than 6 months ago, the founder of the "Growing in Grace Ministry" was billing himself as the second coming of Christ. However, now Jose Luis de Jesus Miranda says he's the Antichrist.
...But de Jesus, who preaches that the devil and sin do not exist, isn't necessarily declaring himself the devil. FIU religion professor Daniel Alvarez thinks he may be playing on an ambiguity of the word Antichrist, meaning taking the place of Christ. In other words, because he claims to be the second coming of Christ, he rejects the continued worship of the old Christ: Jesus of Nazareth.
If There Be Dragons, Why Not a Flood?
On February 24th the History Channel is airing a special which speculates on the past existence of dragons. In their description of the show they write:
"Throughout history, dragons influenced wars, science, art, and religion. They appear in almost every culture and many still believe in dragons. How could different cultures, isolated by geology and millennia, all invent the same creature? If the dragon is simply the product of our imagination, how could distant peoples, with no knowledge of each other, all invent the same beast?"
Good question. But what I find interesting is that much of the secular world does not use the same logic when it comes to a worldwide flood. Instead, they say that because
there are flood stories in every culture, that somehow discounts Noah's Flood - that the story was just handed down over the centuries and modified. Someone isn't using their head!
So Much For Global Warming!!
From The Drudge Report
HOUSE HEARING ON 'WARMING OF THE PLANET' CANCELED AFTER ICE STORM
Tue Feb 13 2007 19:31:25 ET
The Subcommittee on Energy and Air Quality hearing scheduled for Wednesday, February 14, 2007, at 10:00 a.m. in room 2123 Rayburn House Office Building has been postponed due to inclement weather. The hearing is entitled “Climate Change: Are Greenhouse Gas Emissions from Human Activities Contributing to a Warming of the Planet?”
The hearing will be rescheduled to a date and time to be announced later.
DC WEATHER REPORT:
Wednesday: Freezing rain in the morning. Total ice accumulation between one half to three quarters of an inch. Brisk with highs in the mid 30s. North winds 10 to 15 mph...increasing to northwest 20 to 25 mph in the afternoon. Chance of precipitation near 100 percent.
Wednesday Night: Partly cloudy. Lows around 18. Northwest winds around 20 mph.
Word of Faith Preachers - Repent!!!
From yesterday's Toronto Globe and Mail
A religious television channel that has encouraged viewers to liquidate their retirement savings and charge up credit cards to make donations in the name of God may learn today whether it answers to Canada's broadcast regulator as a higher power.
The Miracle Channel, which is carried across the country on cable, is expected to be questioned about its fundraising methods when it appears before the Canadian Radio-television and Telecommunications Commission.
At the heart of the debate are statements by on-air hosts during past fundraising drives. In one of the most controversial examples, a host told viewers in 2004 to cash in their Registered Retirement Savings Plans (RRSP) for donations.
"There is somebody right now watching, and God is speaking to them about RRSPs. They've got RRSPs, and they've got a sizable amount, and it's a security thing. Well, it's not a security thing; your security is in God. And God's speaking to you to cash those in. And I dare you to do it," the host said.
...A CRTC hearing starting today will consider the application to expand the station's broadcasting power. But the regulator will also look into whether The Miracle Channel has adequately responded to complaints about high-pressure tactics and promises of a windfall after money is given.
...Under Canadian law, the CRTC lacks the power to sanction broadcasters if they are found to have run afoul of the rules. It can pull a broadcaster's licence, but that step is considered a last-resort option.
However, the CRTC can exercise its power during licence hearings, and can refuse to grant concessions to a licence holder if the regulator believes the broadcaster is not complying with federal rules.
...Excerpts from fundraising campaigns on the Miracle Channel that have raised concerns with the CRTC.
"There's a businessman right now that's watching this program in his business, in his place of business that is about to go bankrupt. He's about to lose it all. He is discouraged, he is frustrated and I have a word for you . . . Right now, there's a certain amount in your bank account right now. And I'm just going to speak what I feel the spirit of God gave me. You're about to lose it all anyway, so you need to sow it into the miracle of the Miracle Channel, and your whole business is going to turn around, not months from now, days from now."
"We've had several tonight give $10,000 . . . And you know what one person did Gwen? [addressing another host] They have $5,000 and they gave it, but they felt to give ten [thousand], they put the other 5 [thousand] on their credit card. And we believe that God is going to give that back to you and you are going to be able to pay it off real fast."
Good for them! So why isn't the FCC down here in the U.S. keeping an eye on the Trinity Broadcasting Network and the Inspiration Network, in order to protect the public?? Or maybe it should be the Food and Drug Administration doing that, given the amount of indigestion their programs give me.
See the TBN equivalent by "prophetess" Juanita Bynum:
You watching me in television land and you saying all I got is $900. But I hear the Lord saying "I double dare people that are watching me right now, this one is for you, I double dare you to empty your checking account. If you got $79.36, empty it out. Empty it out, at the voice of the prophet. If you got $736.19, if you're in the audience right now" - you all looking at me like I'm crazy, like I done went off. Oh, Jesus, if you got $79.36 I double dare you to write your last check and declare your back account empty, because God said something happens when you give Him his last. He multiplies when you give Him your last. - Nov. 7, 2003
John Paul Jackson has a wonderful little message
(I'm sure) on
How To Get God to Act on Your Behalf (It's Actually His Will For You!)
You'll learn valuable insights on to how to get God to act on your behalf -- PLUS you won't have to manipulate God in order to have this happen. He will act from HIS heart for you.
Sounds like manipulation to me!!
Unfortunately, I'll never know how to do it since it would cost me $16 to find out in his audio message (since I'd have to buy an additional message from Patricia King as well). I wonder who's trying to manipulate who?
Look Out Church - The Takeover is Near
An "Apostle" by the name of Mike McLung is warning us on the Elijah List:
2007--GOD'S GOVERNMENT IS BEING SEATED AND
HIS ORDER ESTABLISHED"
This year, the Lord will begin to set His body, His leaders, and apostolic government in order. We must heed the Word of God and the voice of the Holy Spirit and come into proper alignment. We must begin to get "seated" in the middle of God's will for our lives, families, churches, and regions in order to prepare for the governmental order of the Lord to be established. The Kingdom of God is about to break-in upon us as we have never seen before. If we will make the necessary adjustments and realignments, we will see the glory of the Lord and receive divine strategy to mobilize the body of Christ.
...There are many ministers, ministries, and churches that are actually hindering the full revelation of the Lord and His purposes in the Church and in the earth. When He is revealed, true transformation begins, both inwardly and outwardly. There is a clarion call for the five-fold ministry and the body of Christ to come into proper order and submission, and to embrace the specific calling and mantle that each one of us has.
So the rest of us had better straighten up and get our act together, because a takeover is about to happen! I would assume those he speaks of who are hindering God are those who stand for biblical truth.
His apostolic friend C. Peter Wagner offered his opinion of those who stand for correct doctrine last Fall. His little tirade against theologians can be found about 2/3 down the page on the blog of Ministries Today
. He writes, in part:
Let's do away with the term “theologian." Why? The idea that certain members of the body of Christ are theologians while the rest are non-theologians is traditional thinking embedded in the old wineskins of the church. The theologians saw themselves as the elite guardians of the truth. Their assignment was to make sure that the doctrines espoused by the seminary remained pure and uncontaminated. In their minds, we missionaries did not have the skills which the theologians had developed, and consequently we were regarded as mere practitioners, not serious thinkers.
...We [in the New Apostolic Reformation] do not have an ecclesiastical office of theologian nor do we have recognized functional equivalents. We do not agree that an elite group of individuals who happen to have advanced academic degrees in theology should be recognized as our doctrinal police force.
...When I was teaching in seminary, I was coerced by the institution to refer certain matters to the theologians, which I of course did, but much to my personal grief. I began teaching signs and wonders and students began getting healed and delivered right in class. The theologians declared that it was inappropriate to heal the sick and cast out demons in a seminary classroom. They forced me to cancel the class for a time. Then I began teaching about territorial spirits and strategic-level spiritual warfare. This time I was called before the Faculty Senate to undergo a heresy trial. Fortunately for me I had been granted academic tenure years ago, and the theologians finally had to back down on the grounds of violating my academic freedom.
...Those of us attempting to receive the new wine in new wineskins will be better off if we say good bye to theologians.
C. Peter Wagner Wagner Leadership Institute Colorado Springs, Colorado
Yes, those who stand for doctrinal truth could really throw a wrench into the plans of people like Peter Wagner - that is, if the church as a whole was really interested in truth.
You're About To Receive the Wealth of the Wicked!
Rick Joyner's latest post
UNPRECEDENTED PROSPERITY IS COMING TO GOD'S PEOPLE--OUR OBEDIENCE IS KEY"
One of the most often repeated teachings in recent times has been centered on the Biblical prophecies which state that "the wealth of the wicked will be given to the righteous." The prophecies actually go further than this and state that the wealth of the nations will be brought to the righteous. Because these are Biblical prophecies, we know that they will come to pass. This is about to begin, and we must be ready for it.
I realize that this may sound like just another reciting of the prosperity teachings, which is a good thing to many, and a bad thing to others. However, as we proceed, you will find that what I am sharing with you is different from what you have heard before. If we believe the prophecies, we know that unprecedented prosperity is coming to God's people.
He goes on to warn about the dangers of having so much money. He also says:
Last year I was told by a friend that looked up my name on the internet, that there were about 50,000 references to me, and most of them were bad! This did not surprise me. In fact, it encouraged me. I was shown many years ago that this would be the result of my obedience.
If that was the measure of obedience to God Hugo Chavez must be nearing sainthood! Could it be possible that discerning Christians are warning others about him? Naaaah!!!
Health and Wealth teachers often quote the passage that says the wealth of the wicked will be given to the righteous. But what does this really mean? I had a hard time finding any Prosperity website that gave its readers the location in Scripture of this verse. It comes from Proverbs 13, and verses 21-22 say,
21 Misfortune pursues the sinner, but prosperity is the reward of the righteous.
22 A good man leaves an inheritance for his children's children, but a sinner's wealth is stored up for the righteous.
This doesn't sound much like the wealth of the wicked being transferred to the righteous at some point in the prophetic future. From the context it is apparent that Solomon was talking about the here and now.
We know that misfortune doesn't always pursue the sinner - many non-Christians live very successful lives and die with plenty of money and plenty of friends. We also know that prosperity does not always accompany the righteous. Ask the Apostle Paul. Ask Martin Luther. Ask the countless Christians who have been martyred throughout church history. I doubt that these Christians were able to leave a financial inheritance for their children either. Does that mean they weren't Christians?
But in God's justice, misfortune ultimately finds the sinner when he dies and the righteous, upon their death, inherit a prosperity they never imagined in their lifetime.
- Psalm 49:10 "For all can see that wise men die; the foolish and the senseless alike perish and leave their wealth to others."
PS. I understand that we are all sinners and that no one is righteous apart from Christ, but for the purposes of this argument I use "sinners" to represent non-Christians and the "righteous" to represent Christians, since this is what Word Faith teachers mean.
- Psalm 49:16, 17 "Do not be overawed when a man grows rich, when the splendor of his house increases; for he will take nothing with him when he dies, his splendor will not descend with him."
Swindling the Swindlers
From the Feb. 1st Dallas Morning News:
A federal judge on Wednesday sentenced a former Canton ceramics salesman to 40 years in prison for swindling millions from hundreds of Christian investors.
U.S. District Judge Barbara Lynn had harsh words for Gregory Setser, 50, whose four-month trial last year produced a parade of ruined investors - who together lost more than $60 million - that she found "terribly disturbing."
"This crime is as horrific as a crime of violence," Judge Lynn said. "It was a giant holdup."
...Targeting mostly Christian investors, including televangelist Benny Hinn, through churches and other groups, Mr. Setser claimed that his company, IPIC Investments, could produce up to 50 percent returns by buying cheap, foreign-made products that would be sold to major U.S. retailers such as Michaels, Hobby Lobby and Costco.
My question is, how many years should Benny Hinn get for swindling his followers?
The Fruits of Emotion-based Christianity
I was browsing through some old editorials by Charisma's J. Lee Grady (I believe reading stuff like this is the Protestant equivalent of Purgatory) and came across his entry for May 2006 titled "What Happened to Brownsville's Revival?"
What he describes (and still supports anyways!) shows what happens when you base your Christianity on emotionalism instead of the unchanging Word of God. In reads, in part:
In the early days of the revival, the faithful came by bus, car and airplane from all over the world. Eager worshipers waited for hours in the sweltering humidity to get a seat for 7 p.m. services that often lasted past midnight. When evangelist Steve Hill finished his nightly sermons—in which he demanded repentance from spiritual compromise—the majority of people in the auditorium would run to the front of the church and bury their faces in the floor.
...Wailing was commonly heard during those meetings. Some people shook under the weight of conviction. It did not matter if you were a drug addict needing conversion or a pastor living in secret sin—everyone found forgiveness and an unusual sense of refreshing in that holy place.
...I don’t question whether the Holy Spirit was in that place. But today, more than 10 years after the Pensacola Outpouring occurred, I am asking other questions.
I am wondering why the church that hosted hundreds of thousands of visitors has shrunk to a few hundred members and now owes millions of dollars for a building they can’t fill. I am struggling to understand why so many people who once were part of the Brownsville church now feel hurt and betrayed. I am wondering if the leaders of this movement mishandled the anointing of God’s presence like Uzzah did when the ark of God almost toppled on the ground (see 2 Sam. 6:6-8).
...It is no secret that relationships among various leaders at the Brownsville church were strained to the breaking point. Michael Brown, once the leader of the Brownsville Revival School of Ministry (BRSM), was fired in 2000 and then started his own training center that he eventually moved to North Carolina.
BRSM in its heyday had an enrollment of 1,200 students. That number shrank to 120 this year. This week the church announced that the ministry school will relocate to Louisiana, where it will be directed by revivalist Tommy Tenney.
...The pastor of the church during the revival, John Kilpatrick, resigned in 2003 and told parishioners he planned to remain at the church in an apostolic role. Kilpatrick installed Randy Feldschau as the new pastor, then this year Kilpatrick shocked the congregation by starting a new church in Daphne, Ala., 50 miles west of Pensacola.
Feldschau resigned a few weeks ago and moved to Texas, and Brownsville’s attendance has dipped below 400. One former staff member told me that a large group of Brownsville members now attend a local Southern Baptist church in the city, while many others don’t go anywhere.
“People have been leaving for three or four years,” the pastor told me. “Some are not in church at all, including some who were on staff. I don’t know anyone who has not been hurt.”
At one point during the heyday of the movement, Korean pastor David Yonggi Cho announced from Brownsville’s pulpit that the revival “would last until Jesus comes.” Certainly the fruit of this revival will remain that long. But for those in Pensacola who were swept up in the ecstasy of those early years, and then endured splits, resignations, debts and disappointments, the word “revival” now has a hollow ring to it.